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Post by eurache on Mar 13, 2006 18:47:53 GMT -5
To be aired 8PM ET: Sunday March 19, 2006 on CBS
Writer: Veena Cabreros Sud
Director: Nicole Kassell
Show Stars: Tracie Thoms (Kat Miller (Episodes 3.13+; recurring previously)), Thom Barry (Det. Will Jeffries), Kathryn Morris (Det. Lilly Rush), John Finn (Lt. John Stillman), Jeremy Ratchford (Det. Nick Vera), Danny Pino (Scotty Valens)
All Guest Stars: Bill Schoesser (Vagrant), Hallock Beals (John Doe (1968)), Rosemary Alexander (Mrs. Harding), Cole Williams (Justin), Shiloh Fernandez (Valentino), Anne Gee Byrd (Mrs. Jablonski (2006)), Tom Wagner (Mr. Jablonski (2006)), Scott Vickaryous (John Doe (1980)), Zeljko Ivanek (John Doe (2006)), Tim Haldeman (Mr. Jablonski (1980)), Jolene Hjerleid (Mrs. Jablonski (1980)), Taylor Handley (Steve Jablonski (1980))
Lilly and the cold case team will have to decode the clues given by a twisted killer in order to save the life of a young boy who has been left to die alone. But first they must find the boy and for that they need to dig a little deeper into their own pasts.
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Post by leslie33 on Mar 15, 2006 19:28:26 GMT -5
I just saw the preview to the Episode a few seconds ago. Looks pretty intense. :smile85:
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Post by longislanditalian2 on Mar 15, 2006 19:33:19 GMT -5
I can't wait to see this episode, it looks scary
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Post by eurache on Mar 15, 2006 19:36:20 GMT -5
The preview with the guy holding the shovel looked scary  |
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Post by longislanditalian2 on Mar 15, 2006 21:04:43 GMT -5
That guy with the shovel guest starred on the x-files
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Post by leslie33 on Mar 15, 2006 22:10:05 GMT -5
It sort of looks along the lines in which Nick was buried alive in CSI. Man that episode had me crying.
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Athame
Loyal to Look Again
Hiding Duck
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Post by Athame on Mar 15, 2006 22:19:44 GMT -5
It sort of looks along the lines in which Nick was buried alive in CSI. Man that episode had me crying. Hehe, it had me wanting to kill the network. They aired the first part of that episode in November and the second in February :smile7: |
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boxman
Lilly's Bedroom 
Philly Reporter [/color]Foxy Boxy [/color]
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Post by boxman on Mar 16, 2006 0:13:37 GMT -5
It sort of looks along the lines in which Nick was buried alive in CSI. Man that episode had me crying. Hehe, it had me wanting to kill the network. They aired the first part of that episode in November and the second in February  Oh, no way! How cruel of your networks! This episode looks like another big one... |
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Athame
Loyal to Look Again
Hiding Duck
Do you like this pumpkin!?
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Post by Athame on Mar 16, 2006 0:25:49 GMT -5
Hehe, it had me wanting to kill the network. They aired the first part of that episode in November and the second in February Oh, no way! How cruel of your networks! This episode looks like another big one... Yes, 'twas *sniff* |
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Post by longislanditalian2 on Mar 20, 2006 5:37:48 GMT -5
Lilly has really changed this is the fist time we've even heard about what she was thinking before she shot george. The rain symbolize the quiet in her head right before Lilly pulled the trigger ,she mention she'd do anything not to have hav walked into the attice, but wait back the episode of "the woods" Lilly did that on her own so she almost got shot and walked into the face of death herself. At the beginning it was raining and the guy,steve was fixing a flat hmmm , Jeffries wife was trying to fix a flat before she got killed I think this guy "john" brought up a lot of memories fo Jeffries making him ponder what was her last thoughts before she died. Again the writers are foreshdaowing something that might hurt Vera , something possibly to do with his marriage, we wil have to just wait and see. Scotty realy got that guy to tick in the interrigation room ,sitting so close to him . Back to Lilly , it seems like Lilly did have such a bad childhood, I don't think she is lying about this story to get him to talk. About her as a little girl trying to ride a bike, did anyone catch her face on this one? Lilly seemed to be happy as she told this story as kid she closed her eyes and felt the wind on her face , mayeb at that point she thought she live forever. Lilly might be realizing maybe some of her childhood wasn't all that bad , there were some good times , I think personally she has gotten stronger about herself ,maybe she is starting figure herself out. She was very powerful powerful in the episode ,cutting to chase but maybe realizing things about herself . I loved that song at the ending " Lifehouse - you and me" , I think she was happy that guy let the boy live, she looked very happy before seeing the victim .As said before we all don't really know lilly ,but only what we see on her face. The guy John , just b/c you are dying for 26 yrs doesn't mean you have to kill a young innocent 17 yr old. All young people think they can live forever, but soon realize as they come into adulthood that will never be possible, I didn't see any clue that Lilly even thought that but I could be wrong. The guy should have made the best of the remainder of his life, not spead it behind bars , Lilly was tought and a little softhearted she looks very worn and tired still but who knows?
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Post by TVFan on Mar 20, 2006 12:37:55 GMT -5
This was a really full episode. There was so much going on, not just overtly, but also subliminally. I was really impressed with this outing. First of all, Veena did an excellent job separating this killer from George. I was a little worried that this episode was just going to be a Mind Hunter redo, but it was entirely different from that ep. It was equally as psychological, though, and those tend to be my favorite eps anyway. We knew all along that John was the killer, it was trying to figure out why he did what he did that kept me thoroughly involved. I assumed early on that John was suffering from a terminal disease, and thus, why he was coming forward and confessing to his crimes, but I didn't know how the disease tied into the murder(s). Being diagnosed with a terminal disease at such a young age and realizing that he wasn't going to live forever made him so angry that he wanted to take that from someone else who was young. He was faced with his own mortality, and he just couldn't handle it. Then 26 years later, he gets the rude awakening that his MS is entering its final stage and he once again has to face his own mortality and once again, he can't handle it so he attempts to take another's sense that they will live forever. Even though Lilly and co. got to the second victim in time, it was still too late for that young man to believe that he will live forever, so John did succeed on that front.
I thought this ep was a departure, not only from the usual CC fare, but also from Veena's usual emotionally charged episodes. This was a "wow" episode like her usuals, but in a different way. I liked the versatility of her talent that this episode displayed. Even though this case was rooted in an older murder, the episode was focused on the present day victim because there was a push to save him. We actually knew more about him than the 1980 vic. I'm guessing this is why the closing song was a present day song and not one from 1980. Interesting departure, though.
Lilly had some awesome interrogation scenes in this one. In fact, these are her best since Mind Hunter. I loved the way she thought John was BS-ing her at first and called him on it. She changed her tune as soon as he recited the will, though. It's weird because she doesn't interview him again until the very end. It was fitting to have her in there with him since she realized that they had something in common. They had both lost the sense that they could live forever. Lilly had hers taken from her last year when she stared down the barrel of George's gun. It's funny because I always assumed that shooting/killing George or reliving painful childhood memories or even allowing that crap George fed her to get into her head would be weighing on her the most regarding the George situation, but according to this ep, is was facing her own mortality. And on top of it, knowing that she put herself in that situation and still regretting it to this day. As she recounted the time that she learned to ride her bike and how alive she felt and how it contrasted to the more sullen realization that that feeling has faded away, I couldn't help but applaud Kathryn for her beautifully understated acting. She brought Lilly to the brink, but held her back, always maintaining control. She just never ceases to amaze me. Why Emmy voters, why won't you nominate her? The way they decided to bring up the George thing brought about some nice, unforced closure that we were lacking so badly.
The one misstep in this episode for me was the fact that they didn't utilize the time factor very well. I was expecting to be on the edge of my seat the entire episode as I was with a similar episode of Law & Order: SVU, but it didn't happen here because CC didn't give us the sense of urgency that this ep needed. We never really had a good grasp on how much time was left before victim #2 suffocated to death at an unknown location. Even when the detectives did bring up the time, it was more of an afterthought. From the press release, I had the impression that this ep was going to be very intense, but it wasn't. The time element seemed especially needed in this one because it revolved around one setting - the interrogation room - and a small amount of time (as opposed to the several days that usually go by). When a show does this, it slows down the pacing. Accentuating the time crunch would have helped with the pacing problem. I was also looking for a huge climax when the detectives went to rescue the second vic, but all we got was Lilly arriving after he was already safe. Just a small complaint, really, and honestly, neither took away from this episode. It was strong enough, but with the time element, I think this episode would have been moved from excellent to awesome for me.
Still, a very excellently done episode.
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Post by sonny on Mar 20, 2006 13:40:31 GMT -5
Lilly had some awesome interrogation scenes in this one. In fact, these are her best since Mind Hunter. I loved the way she thought John was BS-ing her at first and called him on it. She changed her tune as soon as he recited the will, though. It's weird because she doesn't interview him again until the very end. It was fitting to have her in there with him since she realized that they had something in common. They had both lost the sense that they could live forever. Lilly had hers taken from her last year when she stared down the barrel of George's gun. It's funny because I always assumed that shooting/killing George or reliving painful childhood memories or even allowing that crap George fed her to get into her head would be weighing on her the most regarding the George situation, but according to this ep, is was facing her own mortality. And on top of it, knowing that she put herself in that situation and still regretting it to this day. As she recounted the time that she learned to ride her bike and how alive she felt and how it contrasted to the more sullen realization that that feeling has faded away, I couldn't help but applaud Kathryn for her beautifully understated acting. She brought Lilly to the brink, but held her back, always maintaining control. She just never ceases to amaze me. Why Emmy voters, why won't you nominate her? The way they decided to bring up the George thing brought about some nice, unforced closure that we were lacking so badly. I couldn't agree with you more here TVFan. I totally loved Lilly's reaction when she thought John was screwing with her. It was so nice to finally see what Lilly was feeling when she was in that attic and how exactly it has effected her. We never really suspected that the Lilly faced with the thought of dying was probably why she has been the way she has this season. Like you said TVFan we all kind of assumed it was the painful memories or the shock of having shot someone for the first time. It makes me wonder now what George was thinking as he was starring down the barrel of Lilly's gun? I can't agree with you more as well about Kathryn's acting. She is just amazingly brilliant!! It pi$$es me off that she gets no recognition for her talent, when she is so much better than alot of actresses that get awards just cos the show they are in happens to be more 'cool' or because they are married etc to someone else who's famous! The one misstep in this episode for me was the fact that they didn't utilize the time factor very well. Even when the detectives did bring up the time, it was more of an afterthought. From the press release, I had the impression that this ep was going to be very intense, but it wasn't. The time element seemed especially needed in this one because it revolved around one setting - the interrogation room - and a small amount of time (as opposed to the several days that usually go by). When a show does this, it slows down the pacing. Accentuating the time crunch would have helped with the pacing problem. Still, a very excellently done episode. I don't agree so much with this one cos I think there were subtleties that gave a picture of the time frame. What I liked was that although the pressure was on to find Justin, the team remained calm and focused and didn't get to pushy or look to desperate. That would kind of played into John's hands and he may not have revealed as much and as soon as he did if they were to full on. I can imagine that this is how a team of detectives would really work. The situation wasn't over dramatized like it so could have easily been. I liked the fact that there was no counting down the hours scenario that is very common in TV shows and movies that involve situations such as the one in this episode. Did you notice the scenes where the clock showed the time either in the background or to the side of the frame? I did and that's why I don't agree so much. Anyway that's all for now cos I run the risk of repeating everything TVFan has said if I haven't already. Great episode, I loved it and I really feel this season is getting better and better as it goes on. ;D EDIT: Just for you TVFan I watched the episode again and found all of the references to time: -Clock behind Jeffries as he walks in and hangs his coat up says 12:15. -The train station clock reads 2:30. -The clock in the distance behind Stillman and Scotty as they reveal the licence plate findings says 4:00. -Vera's watch reads 4:50 as he and Stillman interogate John. -The clock reads 5:33 as the team discover the significance of the ticket stubs to the location of Justin. ;D ;D ;D |
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myril
Veteran Detective
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Post by myril on Mar 20, 2006 14:26:25 GMT -5
I'm ambivalent about this episode. I liked the set-up as a nearly intimate play. It was good acting by all, especially Kathryn Morris could show more of her talent (it was about time). And Zeljko Ivanek was a great choice for the part of John Doe (Harding) The motive of the murderer, the theme of the episode, being confronted with death, basically got me and made me thinking after watching it - but on the other hand I think the story had a major flaw.
Multiple sclerosis (MS) is not a terminal disease, as some might think after this episode. It's an awful chronic disease, but it's in most cases not deadly. Many patients live a full live, but MS can cause impaired mobility and disability. Though for many the diagnose of MS is first terrible and sounds even like a death sentence (I know some people having MS). And some might think of disability as being buried alive in a nearly dead body (or trapped as Stillman said in this episode).
But chances are, that John could have lived for many years to come without more symptoms showing up or getting worse. I think John's idea of him dying should have been seen more on a psychological level, he was fixated that MS meant death for him, a slow and horrible death. It destroyed his believe that he could live forever, of being forever young. And the way John dealt with that thought was by destroying the believe, hope for others as well, choosing young men, who were like he was, making for them real, what happened more or less to him only in his mind. But unfortunately it looked in the episode more like he actually was dying, a major flaw in this story in my opinion, and a missed chanced to make more of it.
Nevertheless there had been great moments in this episode, and so I enjoyed it. The interrogation scenes with Lilly had been something I was waiting for all of this season.
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Post by sukkerspinn on Mar 20, 2006 17:46:03 GMT -5
ok, I'm gonna go ahead and tell you my opinion on this eppy before reading what the rest of you wrote, in order to keep my own thoughts..well..my own. I think this is the first eppy of season 3 that litterally left me speechless! And IMO it ranks even above 3.06, just because of the last interrogation with Lilly and "John". THIS is what I've been waiting for, for WAYY too long. I liked every single moment of the eppy. Music, characters, storyline, ya name it. Only thing I could wish for was a 15 min longer ep. It went on kinda quick sometimes, and it kinda messed up the great story a little. I also gotta say that this is one of not many eps lately that I have NOT been annoyed by Scotty. Maybe there was something to what he said in the prev ep about changing. He was very mature in his solo-interrogation and he handeled it very well, IMO. It was a very reliable storyline and motive for the killer. He was messed up about his thoughts about dieing and wanted back his "live forever" state of mind. As so many probably do. They just don't take it to the psycho-level.. And Lilly. Good 'ol Lilly was back in this ep. And FINALLY talking to US about the George incident. At first I was kinda bummed when I thought that first interrogation scene would be all we got. But I was wayyy wrong. (THANK YOU producers!!!). And I almost couldn't believe how personal she got She was like opening up her entire wall of bricks and pouring out stuff that's been lurking around in there for (!!!!!) A YEAR. (it's been a year?! *sigh* How time flies..) Anyway, I'll stop blabbering. It was a GOOD ep! Me is satisfied! Yay! |
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Post by longislanditalian2 on Mar 20, 2006 19:48:11 GMT -5
It true lilly's walls have come down completly ...
This episode was awesome for the fact they corrolated the five stages of dying to John's illness to his killing crazy , I think he wanted to see death before death got to him
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Post by longislanditalian2 on Mar 20, 2006 22:22:50 GMT -5
I think this is one the best Lilly moments of this season, she's back being strong
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Post by longislanditalian2 on Mar 21, 2006 9:11:30 GMT -5
I also had noticed some when John says " when you are about to die , your whole life flashes in front of you" Lilly then goes on to say " just one" could it be she only have one good memory or was this a setup to get him to stay talking. I doubt the story she told was made up , she sounded happy and carefree not to mention her face lit up bu her voice sounded tired? any thoughts on this
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Post by eurache on Mar 21, 2006 9:12:15 GMT -5
It was a great night for CC. :smile91: Here is a brief discription of what we discussed :smile91: Chat room - "One Night" |
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Post by TVFan on Mar 21, 2006 11:16:53 GMT -5
Touche sonny! I can completely see this point as well. I do appreciate CC's subtlety because this is a show that rarely beats you over the head with anything and allows its viewers to think for themselves. It also seemed to me that this entire episode was beautifully understated. Nothing seemed forced or contrived, the characters were perfectly developed and the acting was top notch on everyone's part. So, I can understand that the time element would play better in this episode as a more subtle reference. I was just expecting more of an edge of my seat feel, but like I said, that would have only enhanced this episode because it was wonderful even without it.  LII asked what we thought Lilly was referring to when she said that just one moment flashed before her eyes as she stared down the barrel of George's gun. I had been wondering this as well. The next story she tells is about riding her bike and feeling the wind on her face and feeling alive, but I think that was more in reference to losing the sense that you will live forever. In the context of the episode, it makes sense that this bike moment is the one that she was referring to as well, though. John keeps saying that when you face death, you realize that you're not going to live forever. At that moment with George, Lilly was facing death and realizing her own mortality, so it seems plausible that she was thinking about the moment when she felt the most alive and like she would live forever. What I find odd is the fact that Lilly works as a homicide detective and deals with death everyday, and yet, she never realized her own immortality until she had a gun held to her head. It's funny how the mind separates and desensitizes us in order to protect our sanity. |
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Post by ewka on Mar 21, 2006 11:21:03 GMT -5
Not my favorite one, but still not so bad. However, the plot did not convince me, I felt like the whole story was a little bit strange.
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