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Post by TVFan on Oct 30, 2008 19:01:50 GMT -5
LILLY AND THE TEAM INVESTIGATE THE 1969 CASE OF A MURDERED 12-YEAR-OLD BOY AFTER A NEW CLUE IS GIVEN TO THE RETIRED COP WHO HAS NEVER LET THE CASE GO, ON "COLD CASE," SUNDAY, NOV. 9
Greg Evigan Guest Stars
Lilly Rush: Kathryn Morris Scotty Valens: Danny Pino Lt. John Stillman: John Finn Nick Vera: Jeremy Ratchford Will Jeffries: Thom Barry Kat Miller: Tracie Thoms Shep "Mack" McAvoy '08: Ed Lauter Danny Finch '69: Jarrod Bailey Laura Finch '69: Ellen Taylor Marlow Laura Finch '08: Karen Landry Chuck Collier '69: Kenton Duty Chuck Collier '08: Greg Evigan Seth Lundgren '69: Braeden LeMasters Seth Lundgren '08: Richard Edson Bobby Kent '69: Noah Matthews Bobby Kent '08: Joel Murray Dick Wallace '69: Doug Scott Kramer Dick Wallace '08: Bart McCarthy Griff '69: Matt Spangler Malcolm Kent '69: Jeff Staron Malcolm Kent '08: Ron Bottitta Shep "Mack" McAvoy '69: Shawn Colten
WRITTEN BY: Taylor Elmore
DIRECTED BY: David Von Ancken
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Post by eurache on Nov 9, 2008 18:35:05 GMT -5
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Post by Electrophile on Nov 9, 2008 22:36:42 GMT -5
Okay, first impression.......this wasn't as good as previous episodes, but it wasn't as bad as last week's. Again, the music in this episode carried it, rather than just complimented it, although that's not to say the episode sucked or anything.
I fingered Chuck as the killer from the first moment we saw him on screen, just because he had that "I'm the boss and you're not" mentality. The fact he saw Danny as a "geek" or some other perjorative showed to me, he didn't value him. Which meant he could just as easily take his life and not think twice about it. Which is exactly what happened. Danny jumped in that creek to try and save him from drowning and when he heard his friends, he told Chuck he wouldn't tell him he fell. To reward that, he killed him. It's always sad when kids kill other kids because a part of you thinks they can't appreciate what they've done, and yet you can see how in some cases, they can. Chuck had a reputation to protect and if he had to kill to do so, then so be it.
I think the saddest part of the whole case was Seth. I was more drawn to his character and his many sorrows more than I was other characters in the case. I was hoping there was better resolution for him than suicide, but mental illness can be more devastating on a person than anything any of us could know. It seemed that Bobby truly cared about him and was supporting him out of a need to be a true friend, but again....Chuck was doing it to maintain his reputation as a "leader" and one with the funds to throw around.
As a side note, I think Vera has really come into his own as a detective this season. This is probably the 3rd or 4th episode so far this season where he's had a really strong moment in interrogation. I thought the way he cornered Bobby and called him a sheep was intense.
Overall, I decided to rate this episode as "excellent" for reasons sadly, not connected to the main plot. I thought the music, the acting of Richard Edson and Jeremy Ratchford and that interrogation scene bumped it up from merely "good".
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Post by yankee1151 on Nov 9, 2008 22:44:56 GMT -5
Why oh why is the doer always the most recognizable guest star? I know this has been discussed many, many times but SERIOUSLY. As soon as I saw "Greg Evigan guest stars" in the ep description, it was game over. Also, I don't think he's played a good guy since "My Two Dads." But he looks exactly the same as he did in 1988 so props to his plastic surgeon/hair colorist/aestetician/mom & dad. You go, BJ.
Other than that, I kinda liked it. I actually thought it was cool that they reopened the case for the old cop. They should probably find some way to charge BJ, oops, Chuck, with Seth's death, too. That was some effed up shiz.
Vera was once again awesome. He seems to have found his bollocks (tm Gordon Ramsay) this season. Not that he didn't have them before, per se, but he's really taking the tough cop routine and running with it. I continue to worry about Ratchford's obesity problem, though. Dude waddles now.
If they brought up this "Cooper" thing solely for the purposes of Lilly bonding with Old Cop Dude and never bring it up again, I will be tiffed. Can she get some closure with SOMETHING?
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Post by Electrophile on Nov 9, 2008 22:45:00 GMT -5
Am I the only one who thinks next week's episode is going to be filler, much like last week's episode? That promo did nothing to entice me to watch it. I'm going to of course, but if you're a casual watcher....I can't see anyone getting pulled in by it.
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Post by Electrophile on Nov 9, 2008 22:46:33 GMT -5
Why oh why is the doer always the most recognizable guest star? I know this has been discussed many, many times but SERIOUSLY. As soon as I saw "Greg Evigan guest stars" in the ep description, it was game over. Also, I don't think he's played a good guy since "My Two Dads." But he looks exactly the same as he did in 1988 so props to his plastic surgeon/hair colorist/aestetician/mom & dad. You go, BJ. Other than that, I kinda liked it. I actually thought it was cool that they reopened the case for the old cop. They should probably find some way to charge BJ, oops, Chuck, with Seth's death, too. That was some effed up shiz. Vera was once again awesome. He seems to have found his bollocks (tm Gordon Ramsay) this season. Not that he didn't have them before, per se, but he's really taking the tough cop routine and running with it. I continue to worry about Ratchford's obesity problem, though. Dude waddles now. If they brought up this "Cooper" thing solely for the purposes of Lilly bonding with Old Cop Dude and never bring it up again, I will be tiffed. Can she get some closure with SOMETHING? I didn't even recognize that as Greg Evigan. Wow. I knew he was guest-starring in the episode, but I totally didn't catch it. I recognized Joel Murray right away.....Bill's brother.
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Post by longislanditalian2 on Nov 9, 2008 23:11:18 GMT -5
From people are saying this looks good, I can't wait to see it. Can't believe I had to work and my DVR isn't working.
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Post by socceroos on Nov 10, 2008 0:24:49 GMT -5
LOVED the episode.
QUESTION: Did I miss something what is this unsolved about Paul Cooper about?
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Post by beldasnoop on Nov 10, 2008 1:40:14 GMT -5
Liked this one a lot. The music was perfect, and the characters were engaging. I called Chuck as the killer early, but I still think it was a very well-done episode.
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boxman
Lilly's Bedroom
Philly Reporter [/color]Foxy Boxy [/color]
Posts: 2,514
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Post by boxman on Nov 10, 2008 2:18:29 GMT -5
Again, lots of very precise and fairly accurately portrayed Philly locations in this episode. Chestnut Hill, Fairmount Park, and Graterford Prison are actual Philly-area places many may remember from previous episodes. The Wissahickon creek does run through a deep gorge in Fairmount Park before merging into the Schuylkill river, though I'm quite sure the actual gorge is a tiny bit larger than what was portrayed in the show. Nice to see water again a recurring symbol of a person's changing fate in the show. Why oh why is the doer always the most recognizable guest star? LOL.... Were they even trying to disguise who the killer was? He also wore a Black Leather Jacket, a well-established symbol for bad guys in the series, and he even drank espresso, an interesting tip-off that something is strange about this guy. (Drinking coffee is an unexplained, yet recurring theme in this series.) There's a lot of coffee and cappuccino drinking in this series, though I think that's the first time I've ever seen someone drink espresso.
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Post by Naj on Nov 10, 2008 8:39:52 GMT -5
Uh, the moon landing was not at night. I remember I watched it with my family and it was daylight like in the afternoon. But that's the actual landing. I don't remember how long it took them to come out of the capsule to do the walk. Also Seth was into the conspiracy side of our shadow NASA program. Yup, and they made him look like a nut for it. I did like this episode as it reminded me of the young girls in The Sleepover from season two. I don't understand how someone can convince his friends Danny died jumping when both friends clearly saw him jump. Guess I missed something there! I love Vera! ;D You might want to head over to the Spoilers forum for that question. All in all I gave this an excellent.
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Post by longislanditalian2 on Nov 10, 2008 9:58:32 GMT -5
I just saw it, really good episode for me. Vera did an outstanding job with the interrogations; but the hanging bit I wasn't expecting. Some people actually believe that the moon landing was just a hoax, and are will exploit the consipiracy about it. Did anyone notice the look on Crackpot Mack's face when he saw Danny's ghost, it was the same look that Lilly first had on her first during the Pilot episode.
Here's the thing that got to me, when Mack was giving Lilly advice; was she really listening?
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mitchy
Desk Clerk II
Posts: 59
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Post by mitchy on Nov 10, 2008 13:12:16 GMT -5
I gave this a good, I was expecting a little more from it than I got, I think, but that was my fault rather than the episode's. Some excellent, excellent work from Jeremy Ratchford this week, he really took losing Seth personally and the subsequent interview with Bobby was another masterpiece. They're really giving him some good stuff to work with this season and he's eating it up. Compliments for the cast of kids who were all great and really sold the friendships/antagonisms well. It can't be easy for a young person to play a killer but Kenton Duty did a great, convincing job. Young Danny was just the right mix of geekiness and awkwardness and props to Jarrod Bailey (and the director, no doubt) for showing that. Also, I really didn't envy those kids having to be in the water, that must have been an uncomfortable shoot and tough to do and film. So Lilly's got a case that haunts her huh? This had better be followed up, CC has actually been doing well on continuity this season and I'd hate for them to blow it now. I'm not sure why I was left wanting after this episode, I think maybe I was just a little depressed about who the killer was; children killing children is always an emotive subject. Definitely more engaging than The Dealer but not as good as WW or RG. I think those two episodes have set the benchmark a bit too high, I need to lower my expectations. ETA: OK, something else that bothers me - did anyone else find it a bit odd that one blow from a tree branch wielded by a 12 year old killed Danny? Do damage, yes, this I believe. Kill outright to the point he didn't get water in his lungs? Umm. I suppose it's feasible he hit Danny on a vulnerable point of the skull, I seem to recall reading somewhere that blows to the temple are often fatal, but I dunno, I think drowning would have been a better CoD this time around. Anyone with more forensics knowledge than me who could clarify this?
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boxman
Lilly's Bedroom
Philly Reporter [/color]Foxy Boxy [/color]
Posts: 2,514
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Post by boxman on Nov 10, 2008 14:25:42 GMT -5
There was an interesting parallel between "One Small Step" and the actual Apollo 11 moon landing. The Apollo 11 mission had a crew of three astronauts, of which only two actually landed on the moon. As mentioned in the episode, Michael Collins remained in orbit to pilot the Command Module, while Neil Armstrong and Buzz Aldrin landed on the moon in the Lunar Module. "One Small Step" portrayed this "crew member separation" situation twice in the episode, the first time when the three kids climbed over the fence leaving Danny behind, then a second time in the final scene where the three kids jump over the gorge, leaving Chuck behind. Another interesting part of the storyline is how Danny's friends and sister grew up to never reach some sort of "pinnacle of human achievement" themselves: Danny's sister is portrayed as hooked on cigarettes; Chuck never made it as an astronaut, and his job as a pilot was downplayed as simply a "bus driver in the air"; Seth came to suffer a mental disorder; and Bobby grew into a spineless retail assistant manager. So while all four are united by knowing Danny, his tragic death probably had more negative influence on their lives than the firsthand positive influence of experiencing the day of 'humankind's greatest achievement'. I gave this a good, I was expecting a little more from it than I got, I think, but that was my fault rather than the episode's. Some excellent, excellent work from Jeremy Ratchford this week, he really took losing Seth personally and the subsequent interview with Bobby was another masterpiece. They're really giving him some good stuff to work with this season and he's eating it up. Compliments for the cast of kids who were all great and really sold the friendships/antagonisms well. It can't be easy for a young person to play a killer but Kenton Duty did a great, convincing job. Young Danny was just the right mix of geekiness and awkwardness and props to Jarrod Bailey (and the director, no doubt) for showing that. Also, I really didn't envy those kids having to be in the water, that must have been an uncomfortable shoot and tough to do and film. So Lilly's got a case that haunts her huh? This had better be followed up, CC has actually been doing well on continuity this season and I'd hate for them to blow it now. I'm not sure why I was left wanting after this episode, I think maybe I was just a little depressed about who the killer was; children killing children is always an emotive subject. Definitely more engaging than The Dealer but not as good as WW or RG. I think those two episodes have set the benchmark a bit too high, I need to lower my expectations. You said exactly what was on my mind, Mitchy! I'd like to add that the actors playing the adult boys were also excellent, especially the older Seth. My attention was definitely fixated on '08 Seth in every one of his scenes. I also really liked the depth that was given to many characters, especially to the younger Dick Wallace in the office flashback. I'm voting for "Good" also, and like Mitchy, it's because I had expected a different kind of story. The previews for this episode had me thinking this would be a story similar to the detectives in the real-life "Boy In The Box" case. (Not the Cold Case episode, but the actual 1957 Philly case. There are articles for this murder and the detectives who investigated it in the "Real Cases" part of this forum.) And to no fault of the writer, but I was also a little disappointed that this murder was very similar to last week's, in which the doer hit the victim on the head in a fit of jealous rage. Perhaps if these two episodes weren't shown back-to-back, this wouldn't be a factor that I would weigh in.
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Post by riche on Nov 10, 2008 15:07:00 GMT -5
I gave it a "Good". It was a small step (see what I did there? ) in the right direction after last week's lacklustre season 5 escapee. I didn't even recognise Greg Evigan, though it is many, many years since I knowingly saw him in anything. Could they even get away with a show called "My Two Dads" these days? I hadn't picked up on the fact that he was in this episode. He seemed a very likely candidate. As soon as we saw the junkyard guy I knew it wouldn't be him, and that he'd turn out to be an OK sort really. It was not going to be Seth either. I also didn't know that Joel Murray (didn't know his name) was related to Bill, though thinking it about it I can see similarities. It took me a while to remember where I'd seen him before anyway, eventually Dharma & Greg came to mind. (Drinking coffee is an unexplained, yet recurring theme in this series.) There's a lot of coffee and cappuccino drinking in this series, though I think that's the first time I've ever seen someone drink espresso. Can you really claim that drinking coffee is a sign of something? There's a lot of coffee drinking on lots of series. We often see the cops of CC drinking it. So Lilly's got a case that haunts her huh? This had better be followed up, CC has actually been doing well on continuity this season and I'd hate for them to blow it now. It's definitely coming up again, though whether they make a good job of it we will have to wait and see.
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Post by lsr on Nov 10, 2008 18:17:06 GMT -5
Why oh why is the doer always the most recognizable guest star? I know this has been discussed many, many times but SERIOUSLY. As soon as I saw "Greg Evigan guest stars" in the ep description, it was game over. Also, I don't think he's played a good guy since "My Two Dads." But he looks exactly the same as he did in 1988 so props to his plastic surgeon/hair colorist/aestetician/mom & dad. You go, BJ. Other than that, I kinda liked it. I actually thought it was cool that they reopened the case for the old cop. They should probably find some way to charge BJ, oops, Chuck, with Seth's death, too. That was some effed up shiz. Vera was once again awesome. He seems to have found his bollocks (tm Gordon Ramsay) this season. Not that he didn't have them before, per se, but he's really taking the tough cop routine and running with it. I continue to worry about Ratchford's obesity problem, though. Dude waddles now. If they brought up this "Cooper" thing solely for the purposes of Lilly bonding with Old Cop Dude and never bring it up again, I will be tiffed. Can she get some closure with SOMETHING? I completely agree, yankee! Whoa.. wait a second.. I completely agree... YANKEE hehe. No, seriously, I do. I really enjoyed the episode (not to mention the awesome 60's music!) but, like you, as soon as I saw Joey..er.. Greg I knew that he would wind up being the killer. It's actually why I never watch any of the L&O series - they seem to live by the same M.O. Vera kicked ass in this eppy, no ifs, ands or buts about that but I was surprised by his new 'bad-cop' persona. Not that I'm complaining! He was awesome but I'd never seen him quite that animated before. As for Lilly... see, yankee!? This is likely a continuation of the "Lilly Story" that we've been waiting for... Maybe?... Not? Granted, I'm not entirely sure how far they will take it but I was sure they wouldn't leave everything up to us to piece together as it was. Anyway, I'm really interested in seeing how the Paul Cooper storyline plays out. Surely I can't be the only one...?
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boxman
Lilly's Bedroom
Philly Reporter [/color]Foxy Boxy [/color]
Posts: 2,514
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Post by boxman on Nov 10, 2008 18:20:05 GMT -5
(Drinking coffee is an unexplained, yet recurring theme in this series.) There's a lot of coffee and cappuccino drinking in this series, though I think that's the first time I've ever seen someone drink espresso. Can you really claim that drinking coffee is a sign of something? ... We often see the cops of CC drinking it. I don't believe I ever have claimed coffee as a sign for anything--I just have always pointed out that coffee tends to appear in many scenes and tends to be consumed a lot in this show. I haven't been able to correlate the appearance of coffee in a scene to symbolize anything or to foreshadow an event or a person's character. This is very much in contrast to other symbols that have appeared in this series. However, the appearance of espresso in this episode is unique, as to my knowledge it's the first time that specific form of coffee has ever appeared in the show. Usually, we see either coffee or cappuccino being consumed. For that reason, I had to stop and mentally note that Chuck drank it, and he turned out to be the doer. While we're on this topic, iced coffee also seems to have first appeared in Cold Case in the episode "Wednesday's Women" during that scene with Lilly, Eddie, and Scotty. Again, nothing seemingly significant.
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Post by riche on Nov 10, 2008 18:54:10 GMT -5
I don't believe I ever have claimed coffee as a sign for anything--I just have always pointed out that coffee tends to appear in many scenes and tends to be consumed a lot in this show. Are we including breathing, talking, walking and sitting as recurring, yet unexplained themes? ;D
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Post by lsr on Nov 10, 2008 19:39:29 GMT -5
Are we including breathing, talking, walking and sitting as recurring, yet unexplained themes? ;D RichE! One might describe you as a person who likes to disturbeth the poopeth. How accurate would one be?
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pealee
Detective
Ray's Woman[/color]
Bring Back EDDIE:)
Posts: 383
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Post by pealee on Nov 10, 2008 20:45:53 GMT -5
I liked this ep. I think it was well written and well acted. Overall I enjoyed it. I'm very intrigued by this Cooper person!
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