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Post by Naj on Jan 14, 2004 15:22:17 GMT -5
I guess it's re-airing tonight. I will have to tape it as I don't have this one either. I think this is the ep where Lilly makes reference about her mother. This was a tragic ep I thought. The guy (don't remember his real name) who played the son was in the audience at the People's Choice Awards Sunday evening.
Lilly re-investigates the case of a murdered church organist, when his alzheimer's-stricken widow begins having flashbacks of the night in question. Lilly's investigation has both Mitchell's son, Ryan, and daughter, Tina, demanding Lilly close the search
~Naj
Guest Cast List:
John Walcutt (Mitchell Baye)
Douglas Smith (VI) (Ryan Baye ('90)
Jimmi Simpson (Ryan Baye)
Kelli Dawn Hancock (Ashley)
Isabella Hofmann (Charlotte Baye)
Aimee Teegarden (Tina Bayes ('90)
Daisy McCrackin (Tina Baye)
Kerrie Keane (Judy Enright)
Kevin McCorkle (Det. Gil Sherman)
Liz Davies (Delores)
Todd Berry (Tom Walsh)
David Forseth (Officer Silvan)
Tisha Frazier (Dani)
Danny Oberbeck (Jeff)
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Post by Naj on Jan 14, 2004 21:49:04 GMT -5
This is the episode that had some of that Xena/Caesar music.
Also Lilly confides that her mom is sick in another kind of way. I wonder if it's mental and if Lilly's mom lives with her or not.
The other part that stood out to me the first time I watched this ep was the mom. The woman who plays the part does an excellent job.
~Naj
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Post by TVFan on Jul 19, 2004 10:43:28 GMT -5
Reruns Sun, July 25. I really don't remember anything about this ep, so I'm glad they're rerunning it!  |
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Post by Tati on Jul 25, 2004 21:01:41 GMT -5
I think this episode has one of the most shocking murder scenes. It was so cruel. I felt really sorry for those kids.
Maybe the woman killing her husband was already a sign of her mental illness ? It was so horrible I can't believe it was just because she was a drunk.
Lilly says her mother is sick in a different kind of way. Since the woman has Alzheimer's, can we conclude that Lilly's mom is not mentally sick? Now we know that she doesn't live with Lilly, so maybe she's in a hospital or a home.
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Post by TVFan on Jul 26, 2004 10:55:34 GMT -5
Tatiana- I have to second you on the horrendous murder scene. I had completely forgotten about that scene. Definitely the most horrific of the season IMO. It kind of creeped me out for the rest of the night.
I noticed that Lilly said that her Mom was sick in a different way too. Didn't she say that her mom was a drunk in "Fly Away"? Maybe I'm crazy, but I thought that this could be what she was referring to.
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Post by eurache on Jul 30, 2004 8:35:33 GMT -5
That was some episode this past Sunday  Gosh, to see that Mom beat up her husband like that in front of the boy ..  That was sad.... I first suspected the son did it and How he would protect his mom, but subconsciously left the door opened; I guess he was hoping she would leave. How sad  I liked when Lilly was talking to the mother and watched the daughter fiddle with her hair, so Lilly played with the ends of her hair too as to portray/immitate the daughter to get the mother to talk. My question is about the socks though, was the socks the clue to them to indicate that the father's clothes were changed elsewhere?  Yeah that was interesting that Lilly mentioned her mom was ill but in a different away. I'll have to watch "Fly Away" b/c I don't remember if Lilly said her mom was a drunk..  |
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Post by Trublu on Jul 30, 2004 18:37:41 GMT -5
Yeah, i thought it was interesting too that just by fiddling with her hair she got the mother to think that she was her daughter. interesting.
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Post by Tati on Jul 30, 2004 20:22:05 GMT -5
Yeah that was interesting that Lilly mentioned her mom was ill but in a different away. I'll have to watch "Fly Away" b/c I don't remember if Lilly said her mom was a drunk.. On "Fly Away" Lilly says that sometimes her mother forgot to feed her because she was too drunk or out on the street looking for a man. It made me wonder if the illness couldn't be related to this "lifestyle". Maybe cyrrosis (sp?), maybe an STD, maybe... AIDS? I guess I'm probably going too far, but who knows... Eurache - about the socks, I think that the fact that the socks were missing indicated that the crime scene was fake. Because if the man had really been there looking for a hooker, he would be wearing his shoes and his socks... it wouldn't make sense he going out not wearing any socks. |
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Post by Naj on Jul 30, 2004 20:33:35 GMT -5
Hello Eurache,
I thought the actor who played the mother did a great job in this episode. I didn't figure it out until they showed the mom's other side that she had done it.
~Naj
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byrdman9802
Lilly's Bedroom 
Kathryn Informant [/center]Lil's Motorcycle Man in waiting [/color]
Posts: 2,361
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Post by byrdman9802 on Oct 6, 2005 19:19:36 GMT -5
Good evening everyone, Hello, it's the Byrdman coming at you all tonight. I hope that everyone is rocking and rolling just like I am!  Hey, I just wanted to let everyone know the info I found on TNT's website. This episode will be reairing on Tuesday, October 18 on TNT (channel 245 on DirecTV) at 10 pm (central time). Just for anyone who might be interested. Thanks for your attention, and take care tonight, everyone. See ya later! |
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Post by sukkerspinn on Oct 15, 2005 14:29:44 GMT -5
Ohhh, this was a GREAT ep!! Very good actors!
by the way... (I don't know if it's mentioned before, but..)
Did anyone else notice the jaw-touching-moment in this one too??
When Lil asks the son about his father being found on Kensington avenue, she touches her jaw AGAIN!
You think this is where the attack happened?!
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Post by Ju on Oct 15, 2005 18:50:37 GMT -5
Did anyone else notice the jaw-touching-moment in this one too?? When Lil asks the son about his father being found on Kensington avenue, she touches her jaw AGAIN! You think this is where the attack happened?! Good point, sukkerspinn!! :smile39: It's possible because she used to live there when she was a child, right? |
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Post by sukkerspinn on Oct 15, 2005 19:52:08 GMT -5
Yeah, that's what I thought...
There should be a thread in the Lilly Rush-forum with a list of all her jaw-touching sceenes, and stuff that could be related to her 49...
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Post by soccerulz on Oct 18, 2005 20:20:45 GMT -5
Woo! I think I'm going to be able to see this episode tonight! I've got so much to do, that I think I'll be up when this airs.
Cool. This is one of my favorite episodes.
And I'll keep a look out for the "Jaw Touching" moment. I always seem to miss those....
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Post by foxfire0114 on Oct 18, 2005 23:44:13 GMT -5
Hmm.. I didn't notice the jaw touching scene. I'll look for it when I watch the episode again. Soccerulz: I always seem to miss stuff like this too! That's the main reason I record the episodes now. =)
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Post by sukkerspinn on Oct 19, 2005 4:22:59 GMT -5
If you looks close, it won't be hard to see. About 10 mins into the ep, when Lilly is talking to the mother and son.
Let me hear your theories afterwards, ok?!
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Post by soccerulz on Oct 19, 2005 14:16:41 GMT -5
Sukkerpsinn: Gah! I totally missed it again! I was even looking for it! *sigh*
Well, I did manage to catch this episode again last night, and (as it always does) it totally freaked me out! haha.
This is one of my favorite episodes. I've always been amazed by those "churchgoing people", who have these dirty awful secrets. Haha, I'm fascinated by the weirdest things!
And seeing a season 1 episode, I was really shocked by all the Lily time! It was seriously all Lily, all the time. I had forgotten how prominent she was in these episodes.
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Post by sukkerspinn on Oct 19, 2005 14:48:22 GMT -5
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Post by soccerulz on Oct 19, 2005 15:00:28 GMT -5
Hey! Thanks so much Sukkerspinn! I'm going to watch it now!
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boxman
Lilly's Bedroom
Philly Reporter [/color]Foxy Boxy [/color]
Posts: 2,514
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Post by boxman on Apr 12, 2006 3:07:50 GMT -5
Wow! What an amazing and impacting episode! The range of personalities that Isabella Hofmann played as the mom was incredible and completely believable throughout!
Again, the writers were quite accurate with the facts. The alleyway of the murder looked like an actual Philly location. Kensington Avenue is an actual street that runs from North Philly to Northeast Philly, and the Market-Frankford elevated railway runs over it. (The "El" wasn't portrayed in the show, though, but still hinted at by the overpass at the crime scene.) In my opinion, this type of transportation infrastructure probably creates as much problems as they solve. The sound of trains running on them drives away residents from the avenues they're built on, and the constant shadow it casts on the ground below encourages drug-dealing and prostitution as shown in the episode. (Today, the city is converting the old, large iron rail structures with slimmer concrete structures. Its already been done on the northeast section of the rail line and is supposed to help reduce noise and allow more light to reach ground level to reduce its negative impact on the street below.) The second-season episode "Kensington" (a 1985 murder) also takes place in this neighborhood, and showed some of the causes for the economic decline of this area in the 80s. When you consider these two elements together, it should be easy to understand how the 70s & 80s economic decline and physical element of the railway led to a sharp rise of vice and narcotic crimes in the area in the early-90s as indicated in the episode. Additionally, these two episodes show why good and apparently wealthy "churchgoing people" were living in such a seedy area--there were really good families living there long before the area started to decline. This also gives some insight to why Detective Sherman was an alcoholic in the years he stated. If this was his regular beat area, he must have gotten swept up in and emotionally overwhelmed by the decline he was witnessing and was probably a part of. With the railway conversion to modern concrete structures and more attention given to the area by police in the nineties, the Kensington neighborhood seems to have stabilized. Still, there is a "white flight" from this area to other parts of the city an suburbs. There is a wikipedia.org entry for Kensington that describes this in some detail. It is also interesting to note that Oxford Circle, the location for season three's "Frank's Best" (a 2001 murder), is located adjacent to this neighborhood. Its about a mile to the northwest. Additionally, West Kensington, the neighborhood where the recent episode "Sanctuary" should have taken place is directly west of this area. (For some reason, they kept saying "West" rather than "West Kensington" in the episode. Perhaps cops call "West Kensington" as "West" for short? That would make some sense, but I don't know.....) But anyway, these episodes taken together also show how the descendants of Italian immigrants of the 19th century have come to live side-by-side with the Hispanic immigrants of the 20th century as shown in "Frank's Best"; and why the neighborhoods in "Sanctuary" are now so heavily ridden with drugs and crime. All in all, I'm very impressed at how the writers have stayed so close and true to the city's real history. It's a testament to their skill and talent.
When Tina tells her mom that the detectives want to talk about Judy (the woman her husband was seeing), it was rather striking to me that they prominently showed the mom reaching for what was apparently a cross on her necklace. At first, it seems to be a reaction in prayer, but after finding out who the murderer is at the end, this short scene had deeper meaning for me. A cross is more than a symbol for religion; the crucifix was in its day a Roman 'electric chair', so to speak. It was a device used to execute 'criminals'; so the mention of Judy's name must have triggered in Mrs. Baye a memory of how she took it upon herself to execute her husband for his sins. A pretty deep visual and symbology. Another striking visual irony is the scene of Lilly's interview with Tom about the porn magazine and hookers at Kensington Avenue. That was a Philly location; most of you will probably recognize City Hall in the background by now. But what was amazingly striking to me was that the Masonic Temple was visible in the background. It looks like a Christian temple and would give an unusual irony to the scene, but it's not Christian. Freemasons believe in a supreme being, but not in the Judeo-Christian tradition. So its use here in an episode about "Churchgoing People" is a bit unusual, especially considering that we also never see a cross at the end of Mrs. Baye's necklace in the other scene either. Perhaps the producers were trying to be sensitive to Christians? It would be interesting to find out some day... PERHAPS ON THE DIRECTOR'S AUDIO TRACK ON THE DVD? Dayum, what is taking them so long??? Ha ha ha... Very interesting to note that Lilly says she grew up in Kensington. Makes sense, too...a lot of tough cookies from that area! Plus, if Scotty grew up "about a half-mile" from Oxford Circle, he's probably from West Kensington, making him and Lilly almost neighbors when growing up. One thing that sucked me into this episode was how they said Mitchell Baye never fought off his abusive wife, Charlotte. I work with a young guy who was briefly in a marriage exactly like that. Rather interestingly, his ex-wife was also very religious, and he didn't see her abusive side until they moved in together after their marriage. Many people say that its a good thing to live with someone before wedlock, and my friend is now a strong believer of that thought. This made me feel pretty bad for the victim as the facts of his murder was unveiled. Unlike my friend who was able to divorce his wife before they had kids, this made me wonder if she didn't sour on that guy until after they had kids?? The incidental music of this episode was extremely clever and completely amazing. I don't think I've heard the piano solo in the opening scene ever before in the series, and it seems to have been written to hint at and smoothly segue into the music for the final montage, Madonna's "Live to Tell". It must have been a great catch for the series to get one of her songs for the series, so I wouldn't be surprised if the background music got extra special treatment. I was in complete awe when "Live to Tell" started to play; the transition between scenes and music was very moving and set up the scene of Tina and Ryan reuniting very perfectly for me. There's so much more to say about this episode. Especially for me to have "season three" knowledge, it was interesting to read everyone else's previous thoughts and speculations. |
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Gosh, to see that Mom beat up her husband like that in front of the boy .. 
That was sad.... I first suspected the son did it and How he would protect his mom, but subconsciously left the door opened; I guess he was hoping she would leave. 
I liked when Lilly was talking to the mother and watched the daughter fiddle with her hair, so Lilly played with the ends of her hair too as to portray/immitate the daughter to get the mother to talk. My question is about the socks though, was the socks the clue to them to indicate that the father's clothes were changed elsewhere? 
